MARK DRISCOLL ON ABC NIGHTLINE FACE-OFF...bringing Mars Hill Church to Mars Hill

Setting Some Wrongs... Right

Some of you seeing me post another article about Mark Driscoll are expecting me to come out of the box swinging, prepared to challenge, do battle against, or slice and dice with some well versed clever sarcasm about Mark and his TV appearance. Well, I hate to disappoint you, but today that will not be happening. 

As many of you know, I have been a very vocal commentator about the scatological pulpit methods that our brother has employed in the past few years. I still firmly believe that a minister of the gospel standing behind the sacred desk to "preach the Word" by divine command in a worship service where the saints are gathered should use words in keeping with that calling. Mark is a gifted communicator and has the platform and skill to really impact this generation for the kingdom. But the man of God's words should reverence the Lord Jesus Christ and reflect His glory; that cut straight His truth to give the sense of it to the people; and yet be palatable for every member of the church; not just those who pass an NC-17 rating. Sound speech is not just the absence of unsavory language; but the presence of that which is grace-filled for the building up of the entire body of Christ in love.

That is where I had failed in addressing these things concerning Mark and his ministry; this is where the Lord convicted me as I reviewed some of my past articles I had written about him. I was not godly in how I used words to speak of those concerns on this blog. IOW, I came to see that in a very real way we have the same problem... just a different manifestation. I find myself identifying with Isaiah in the temple as "a man of unclean lips" that needed to repent of his sin. Unclean lips doesn't necessarily mean here a tongue that uses seedy speech, but rather one that represents a heart that is not right before the Lord - unworthy deserving judgment. That was me; and apart from God's sanctifying grace each day - that is still me. IOW beloved, my heart was not right towards my brother in Christ. I should have been more gracious, charitable and balanced in my words when commenting about his ministry in the Lord. In my zeal to champion reformed biblical theology which I deeply believe, I was blinded to the prideful log in my own eye while blogging about the speck in my brother's eye. For this, I sincerely ask the readers of this blog and those associated with Mark and Mars Hill Church to please forgive me. I have already asked this of Mark privately and he has been most kind to extend to me a heart of mercy. It is my desire to always speak the truth in love and to not carelessly amputate another in that process.

In the wake of this, I am enjoying the beginnings of what I trust will be an ongoing friendship with Mark. My conversation with him has been meaningful and edifying; and he has been nothing short of kind and encouraging. I have come to get a glimpse of the pastor's heart, that is rarely made visible to the wider media-audience, that drives Mark and his passion in ministry. 

The Hearts of the Saints Have Been Refreshed... 

The Apostle Paul says in Philemon 1:7, "For I have derived much much joy and comfort from your love, because the hearts of the saints have been refreshed through you brother." 

So may I take a moment to encourage you and tell you what I appreciate about Mark and his ministry: 

• his affirmation of Scripture as the infallible, inerrant, sufficient, authoritative Word of God; 
• his burden for the salvation of the lost and passion for evangelism; 
• his commitment to the doctrines of grace and to maintain the integrity of the gospel; 
• his desire to plant churches and dedication to local church ministry; 
• his ability to rightly divide the times and to discern the issues facing our cultural from a biblical worldview; 
• to enter into discussion with nonbelievers in public venues about issues concerning the Christian faith;
• for reaching out and ministering to people redemptively who have been abused, shamed, and defiled by this world;
• and for taking a courageous stand for biblical fidelity and orthodoxy by walking the narrow "road less travelled" away from the liberal turnpike of Brian McLaren, Tony Jones, Karen Ward, Doug Pagitt, Spencer Burke, Rob Bell, etc. 

I look forward to meeting Mark one day and trust that the Lord in His providence affords us seasons of genuine fellowship, a real friendship in the Lord, and an on going encouragement to "one another" in the Word of God. 

My Mom has said to me for many years, "if two people agree on everything, then one of them is unnecessary." Mark and I don't agree on everything - but at the same time, it also makes us "necessary" in each others lives. I am confident we won't see eye to eye on some issues in the future. But by God's grace, I pray that I will address those issues biblically, in humility, and personally; seeking his good... protecting the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace. It's good for brothers in the Lord to wrestle through matters of faith, doctrine, theology, and truth; to learn from each other and sharpen each other for kingdom use. But it is also "good for brothers to dwell in unity" as the Psalmist says. So when blogging, may I do so in a way that brings glory to God, protects the integrity of His Word, shows respect for others, forwards His gospel, edifies His church, and to do so from a heart of sincere love, gentleness and humility. I haven't arrived at this in my life beloved; so I would relish your prayers for me to that end. 

His unworthy servant in His unfailing love,

Steve

Col. 1:9-14

ABCNEWS Nightline Face Off - "Does Satan Exist?"

With that said, I wanted to briefly post about Mark's appearance last week on ABC's Nightline Face Off which addressed the potentially explosive and controversial theme of "Does Satan Exist?" There were four panelists for this debate: philosopher Deepak Chopra and Bishop Carlton Pearson faced-off against Pastor Mark Driscoll and Annie Lobert, founder of the Christian ministry "Hookers for Jesus" about the existence of the Devil.

Not many pastors would welcome such a diverse panel and a biased, national news program like ABCNEWS Face-Off into their sanctuary. Nor would they host a debate on an issue concerning an aspect of the Christian faith that allows voices who are violently opposed to biblical Christianity to have a seat at the table. And then still speak with unashamed boldness about the gospel, the Scriptures and its truth while showing reverence and respect for those who oppose biblical Christianity (1 Peter 3:15-16). This is what I call: bringing Mars Hill Church to Mars Hill.

Though the aired portion of this broadcast was edited by ABC beyond even sound bit status, when you listen to the unedited videos of the complete interview (ten in total) you come away with an appreciation for our brother's presence and acumen in this discussion.

Mark was a faithful voice on this broadcast for a few key reasons:

1. He constantly drove the discussion back to the truth of Scripture; the gospel; the person of the Lord Jesus Christ and the overall worldview of Creation, Fall, Redemption, Restoration. He didn't fall into the trap of a theological dualism (god of evil vs. the God of good). He clearly represented Jesus Christ as the only true God and the only way to salvation. He was not favored as one of many ways among the other gods; but the only living and true way in which there is no other God besides Him.

2. He did not use ribald language nor scatological innuendo in cutting through the philosophical pabulum and skubalon of his counterparts. But his use of well-placed sarcasm and biblical truth in unmasking the extensional meanderings of Deepak Chopra for example was brilliant. He remarked at one point, paraphrased: that if man were to invent the story of redemption he wouldn't have come up with the biblical account, but would have made salvation by "eating wings and napping."

3. The ABC interviewer within minutes went immediately to the theodicy question (theodicy deals with the problem of evil in this world. IOW, how can a good, perfect, loving, and holy God create sin, evil, and an imperfect world and still remain Omnipotent, omniscient and omnibenevolent?) This is where I thought the discussion would ultimately go and I thought Mark answered the question in a solid, orthodox, reformed tradition. God made man in His image, and gave him moral freedom, pre-fall, to make choices. Man disobeyed God, sin entered this world, and God sent Jesus on our behalf to redeem man from his sins and give him eternal life and complete forgiveness by grace through faith in Christ alone. Again, he didn't get lost in the minutia of some heady theological construct that wouldn't have been profitable in this venue. I thought he was clear that pre-fall free will is not meant to "let God off the hook" for the existence of evil. But that culpability lies with Satan for his rebellion in heaven; and with our first parents Adam and Eve for their rebellion in the garden. 

God is sovereign over all His creatures and has decreed not only the certain existence of evil but (as my friend James White says so well) "has also decreed the secondary means by which it would come into existence." Clearly, on this prominent issue his comments were God conceived (sound doctrine), Christ centered (exalting to the Savior), and Spirit controlled (done with propriety befitting Christ).

4. Mark has a rare ability to take complex spiritual truth and say them in a simple and pedestrian way that communicates the core meaning (while staying true to Scripture) to those who don't speak Christianeeze or have never darkened the door of a church before. This is a gift; and one I wish more pastors had.

5. He was bringing Mars Hill Church to Mars Hill. In Acts 17 we read the account of where the Apostle Paul was in Athens ministering. He was in the marketplace preaching about the resurrection of the Lord Jesus Christ and His gospel. He was in the synagogues reasoning with the Jews and God-fearing Gentiles. And lastly, he was invited by the Stoic philosophers and Epicurean leaders to come to the Areopagus to come and explain to them this strange teaching they were hearing (i.e. concerning the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead). 

Mark was invited by ABCNEWS to address this issue of the problem of evil in this world and about the nature and existence of Satan. He was on "Mars Hill" to proclaim the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ through the Face-Off Program. He was not offering an opinion on just another view, but heralding the only true view - biblically.

6. His exchange with apostate church leader, Carlton Pearson - was nothing short of brilliant. I knew Carlton in the past and it was very sad to hear him speak of the Christian faith in ways that were clearly heretical. He was in a real way teaching doctrines of demons. Mark was challenging a man who was once one of the glory boys on TBN; a leader within the Word/Faith movement; Oral Roberts' son in the faith; and one of Pentecostalism's favorite sons. Though that heritage is troubling enough, what Carlton is now teaching is clearly from convictions that would render him as apostate. He no longer holds to the authority and perspicuity of Scripture; he doesn't believe in a literal hell or even a literal devil. He denies the importance of the bodily resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead; and also would deny penal substitutionary atonement. He also believes that Christianity is the sacred junkyard of borrowed myths from other philosophical systems. Mark really addressed him and Deepak as one pleading with them to come to the Lord Jesus Christ.

7. Lastly, he by example demonstrated in real time Paul's admonition to the Corinthian church: "I sought to know nothing among you save Jesus Christ and Him crucified." (1 Cor. 2:2). Don't miss this beloved. It is very difficult in this kind of venue and interview that is highly edited and stripped of most of its content to keep Christ and His Word central and prominent in the discussion. Mark used the theme of "Does Satan Exist" to speak about the Lord of all creation at almost every opportunity.

Equipping the Saints

I would encourage you if you are a pastor, Bible student, or lay-leader in the church to really watch these videos several times, study them if you please, to learn how to engage non-Christians on issues of faith. Now I know that there are some who would have desired for Mark to go into the depths of theodicy theologically; to use more reformed buzz words and doctrinal nomenclature. But this would have been fatal. We are to be salt and light to a dying world - and our brother represented the Lord and His gospel well.

March on Your Knees

As these videos are watched more and more by thousands of unregenerate people around the globe in the coming weeks, please pray for them that the Lord was use them in presenting the gospel. I would also encourage you beloved to pray for Deepak and Carlton. Pray that the Lord would grant them saving faith to believe the gospel and repentance from sin to confess Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior of their lives. Pray for Annie that her ministry to the streets of Las Vegas as a former drug addict and prostitute would bring the gospel of grace to many there. And continue to pray for Mark and his ministry at MHC that the Lord would continue to honor his faithfulness to His Word.

Satan maybe mighty, but our Lord Jesus Christ is Almighty; and the gates of Hades shall not prevail against us.  Amen?

I want to end this post the same way that Mark ended his closing remarks on the Face-Off broadcast - by quoting this text from the Word of God:

"We know that we are from God, and the whole world lies in the power of the evil one. And we know that the Son of God has come and has given us understanding, so that we may know him who is true; and we are in him who is true, in his Son Jesus Christ. He is the true God and eternal life" (1 John 5:19-20).